Therapy With BFB Da Packman

BFB Da Packman joins Donald Morrison to talk about everything from addiction and family, to conspiracy theories and Jeffrey Epstein.
By    July 30, 2021
Photo: Donald Morrison

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I wasn’t surprised when BFB Da Packman agreed to let me interview him in my backyard. I live in a small house near LAX and he’s cultivated an image as an everyman rapper. The type to keep his job at the Postal Service even after racking up millions of Youtube views and releasing an album with a Wiz Khalifa feature. He’s currently over 400 pounds and raps about problems the common man has, like having an average-sized penis or hooking up with a girl who didn’t wipe properly. We seemed to have a lot in common.

The first BFB Da Packman song I ever heard was “Tamika” in 2019. The video takes place in front of a Little Caesars and shows BFB dancing, eating pizza and opening doors for female customers. Little Caesars is known as the People’s Pizza for it’s low costs and convenient wait times, and BFB is one of us, looking to feed two on a $5 budget. You won’t find him eating crab out in Malibu at Nobu. The most braggadocious line in the song still feels like a possibility to the average listener: “I’m in Miami with Tamika and Tammi, eating donuts and pussy, I’ma pass on a Xanny.”

BFB Da Packman has quickly distinguished himself as one of the best rappers coming out of Flint, Michigan, a city that’s producing more top-tier rap acts than perhaps anywhere else in the country right now. His penchant for vulgar punchlines and irreverent humor can be directly tied to his Michigan counterparts, like Peezy and Rio Da Yung OG, and is perhaps best showcased on last years “Free Joe Exotic,” a collaboration with Sada Baby that this very blog named as one 2020’s best hip-hop songs. If your average rapper pooped out a track with a buzzword title based on a Netflix documentary it would most likely be corny. But BFB Da Packman isn’t your average rapper and what he delivers is 5 minutes of lowbrow one-upmanship with one of Detroit’s best lyricists, all while wearing an orange hoodie emblazoned with the words “Still HIV Positive.”

The sheer absurdity of his boasts is one way BFB Da Packman stands out from other rappers.
“My bitch about to leave me because I’m built like Patrick, I nut super quick and I be weighing down the mattress, on the low dog, I’m tired of this fat shit,” he says on “Free Joe Exotic.” It’s almost as if he’s satirizing your average rapper and their equally absurd claims of hitting multi-million dollar licks or shooting up clubs by being an animated version of himself.

He grew up in North Flint and went to Northwestern High school, where he was the self described “popular fat kid who gets money and has the prettiest girlfriend.” BFB moved to Houston for a fresh start after serving time for gun possession and landed on his mom’s couch. “I knew I either had to get on my feet or just sit around and get talked to like I ain’t shit,” BFB Da Packman said. “My mom ain’t for the weak, bro.”

BFB Da Packman made good on the promise that was “Free Joe Exotic” with last months release of Fat Niggas Need Love Too, which featured songs with Coi Leray and Zack Fox. It’s better produced than his 2019 debut, God Bless All The Fat Niggas, and shows BFB leaning into a more humorous, or lighthearted tone. The cover of his new album shows a sprawled out BFB being fed donuts by a scantily clad woman on a bed and opens with a 20-second skit where he gets rejected by a woman he recognizes from elementary school. BFB has clearly managed to make the most of his situation despite physical limitations. It’s the reason why he can be self deprecating without it feeling manipulative. It’s only one component of his artistry, and it puts him into a different category than other funny-guy, self referential rappers like Lil Dicky or Trap Beckham.

In fact, BFB Da Packman doesn’t find his music funny at all. In our interview he probes me to think of lines of his that I think are funny, and when I do, he rejects them as only true statements, as if the two can’t be mutually exclusive. I get the sense that for him, focusing on the humorous nature of his lyrics pigeonholes his music into being one thing.

I met BFB Da Packman in Inglewood at Randy’s Donuts, the location of an iconic gigantic plastic donut that hangs over the shop. It’s been featured in films like Iron Man 2 and Mars Attacks!. I photographed him and his crew buying donuts and learned later that BFB Da Packman hadn’t eaten a donut in weeks. When we got back to my house, we talked about everything from addiction and family, to conspiracy theories and Jeffrey Epstein. “These interviews are like therapy for me,” he said. “It’s like I’ve known you my whole life and that’s how it’s supposed to be! It’s not supposed to be awkward.“

He was kind enough to leave me the donuts. – Donald Morrison

What part of Flint, Michigan are you from?

BFB Da Packman: Real Flint baby, real Flint Nigga. I’m from North Flint. Selby hood, Roselawn block.

Is there anything that area is famous for?

BFB Da Packman: No, it’s just an area. Just like a hood in California or a neighborhood in Portland, where you’re from.

How far away is Flint from Detroit?

BFB Da Packman: It’s about 45 minutes.

Did you spend time over there when you were growing up?

BFB Da Packman: No. Completely different areas. It’s like LA and Oakland. Even though Oakland from here is like six hours. Two different cultures. Two different niggas. Just like they gang bang in LA, but not so much in Oakland, people gang bang in Detroit but not so much in Flint. We go by hoods there.

How many different hoods are there?

BFB Da Packman: It’s a small city, so probably like 10 or 12 at max.

Flint easily has the best scene in hip-hop right now.

BFB Da Packman: Thank you! Finally somebody says it. Thank you bro.

What were you like in high school?

BFB Da Packman: Popular fat kid who gets money and has the prettiest girlfriend in high school.

Did you play sports or anything?

BFB Da Packman: No. I was in the streets. I was always more of a hustler than a troubled kid. Everybody wants to be a gangster, everybody wants to be tough, everybody wants to rob, everybody wants to steal, everyone wants to tote a gun. I wanted money, man. That was my drive. I wanted to live life.

Were you a good student?

BFB Da Packman: Yeah, everybody fucked with me. The teachers, the security guards, I got respect from everybody, you know what I mean? The same guy I am now is the same guy I was back then.

Did you ever think about going to college afterwards?

BFB Da Packman: Yeah, I thought about it, but I would have turned my college dorm room into a trap house. So I thank God I never went to college because I would have been selling drugs there for sure. Did you go to college?

I flunked out of community college when I was 18 and didn’t go back to school until I was 25. I just graduated last year.

BFB Da Packman: What made you decide to go back?

I got arrested for possession of heroin in high school and barely graduated in a youth center in Portland. I finally got sober in 2014 and went back to school a year later.

BFB Da Packman: You know what’s crazy? No cap, one of my homeboys said a lot of people do heroin out there in Portland. How did you shake it?

I went to just about every treatment center in Portland, spent time in jail, but nothing really stuck until I got out of the city and went to a rehab in Eugene. I got a job when I got out and slowly started gaining things I didn’t want to lose. Because before I didn’t really have anything to lose by going back out.

BFB Da Packman: Bro, it’s sad to say. But my addiction is food. And that’s terrible. Motherfucker’s can really eat themselves to death!

I always thought that would be a really difficult vice to have. I can go my whole life without seeing heroin again if I don’t look for it. But with food, you have to eat every day.

BFB Da Packman: It’s terrible. It’s just like any other drug and I’m real with myself. I can eat and then like two or three hours later I want to eat again, but I’m not even hungry. You look up one day and you’re 400 pounds. The weight comes faster than a motherfucker. I weighed myself recently and it said 413 pounds. But last time I went to the doctor I was 390. How the fuck do I gain weight like that?

You can’t tell that you’re gaining weight on the day-to-day?

BFB Da Packman: But you can. I’ve been a fat nigga my whole life and it was never hard. It was never hard to put my shoes on and now I’m like what the fuck? It’s hard to put on my shoes, man I gotta lose this shit. I don’t want to end up with diabetes. I don’t want high blood pressure or my kidneys to fail. You could have a stroke and become a vegetable. That’s on the same level as drugs.


BFB Da Packman: And you know what’s crazy? It takes a lot of work for me to burn this shit. For me to become your size, it would take three years of hard work, dedication and strictness.

Can you imagine yourself getting to that place?

BFB Da Packman: Hell nah. Fuck nah, never in life. Me getting thinner? Me getting healthier? My blood pressure getting better? Yeah, I see that. But skinny? Like you? Or him and him? [Points to his entourage.] Well, he ain’t really skinny. He’s more stocky. For me, I have a lot of willpower right now. I want a donut so bad, but I haven’t had one in forever.

Now I feel bad for having you meet me at a donut shop.

BFB Da Packman: No way bro, that’s my brand. You’re just doing your job. This is a brand for me. I’m going to be around donuts so much. I haven’t had one in a while and I feel good. But I still eat ice cream sandwiches and shit. My next big thing is trying to cut out all the sugars. I think one of the only reasons I don’t have diabetes yet is because I’m a pescatarian. Diabetes comes from high cholesterol and red meat, that’s what it really comes from. I haven’t had red meat since 2016.

What got you to cut out red meat?

BFB Da Packman: Back in 2016 I used to be as big as I am now. First I started running. I was just jogging, jogging, jogging. I could jog longer than any skinny person. It might sound crazy, but I recorded myself running a mile and I did it in six minutes.

Then my ex-girlfriend died and I just stopped working out. I really just let myself go from 2017 to 2021. Now four years later and I’m back to the fat nigga I was to begin with. But I’m about to lose this shit all over again. I’m going to jog my ass off, but this time I’m going to put some weight behind it because I’m getting older.

When I’m this heavy, jogging is terrible for me. It’s terrible for my knees. It’s really unhealthy. Back when I was thinner, my girl used to put ice on my knees after I got done running because they’d be hurting so bad. That’s over 300 pounds running on some legs. My bones ain’t no bigger than yours. See, fat niggas get it twisted. When people say “big boned,” we don’t actually have bigger bones. All our bones look the same. We got little bones, it’s just a bunch of shit around these bones.

I appreciate you sharing all that with me.

BFB Da Packman: For sure, I just had to show that we all have struggles, bro, we all have addictions. Everybody. We all have our vices.

You moved from Flint to Houston, Texas when you were 19. Was there a specific reason for the move? What was going on in your life at the time?

BFB Da Packman: Better opportunity, bro. I had a drug and gun case and I was just tired of the same old shit. I wanted to do something different.

Did you have people in Houston?

BFB Da Packman: My mom had been living out there and I visited one time while on probation. I was scared as hell, so I stayed in the house because I didn’t want to get pulled over. See, I ain’t with that going to jail shit, bro. I’m doing everything I can to not go to jail except snitching.

One thing about me, man, I’m all about growth. I’m ready to do it. I’m ready to suffer for it. I might be slow doing it, I might take my time or be hesitant, but if it comes with change or bettering myself, I’m doing it.

Were you quick to find a community in Houston since your mom had lived there? Did it take you very long to find a job and get back on your feet?

BFB Da Packman: Hell yeah, but at the same time, hell nah. I was down there suffering, bro. My mama didn’t have shit. She was on Section 8, always stressing. It was stressing me out, making my life harder. Each and every day I’m going through a heartbreak. I didn’t have any money. I’d spent all my little trap money or drug money that I made.

But it was sink or swim and I understood that. I knew I either had to get on my feet or just sit around and get talked to like I ain’t shit. My mom ain’t for the weak, bro.

Did you grow up with your mom in Flint?

BFB Da Packman: Yeah, she didn’t move to Houston until I was grown.

Do ya’ll still have a good relationship?

BFB Da Packman: Me and my mama have a great relationship, bro. I know if all this shit disappears today, she’s still going to be here by my side. She’s all I got in reality.

Nobody loves you like your mom.

BFB Da Packman: Except for your kids and you don’t have any.

How did you know that?

BFB Da Packman: Because you said “nobody is going to love you like your mom,” but if you have kids then you know nobody is going to love you like your mom and kids. Those are two people who won’t ever turn their back on you. Your bitch will leave, your niggas will leave, friends, siblings, whatever.

Was your dad around at all?

BFB Da Packman: I was raised by my step pops. My pops was around and I knew who he was, but he’s a sucker. He didn’t even have to be there financially. I just wanted him there to give me game, you feel me? I’ve always been a logical kid. But there’s some things that a father will do that you don’t even notice until you’re older and then it’s like damn, you really weren’t shit! You start wondering “did he really love me?”

You have a line about Jeffrey Epstein on your new album. When you talk about conspiracies are you just joking around? Or do you actually read up on them?

BFB Da Packman: I actually read up, bro. They say he has enough money to disappear and I agree. Even though nobody knows where the fuck his money comes from. Do you know?

People say it was from blackmail. That he created a sex trafficking ring of underage girls that ended up hosting some of the world’s richest and most powerful men. Then he would secretly record their hookups and use it as blackmail to get control of their finances and other political favors.

BFB Da Packman: So with that being said, some people say he’s too rich to be dead and he has connections. That they just took him away and hid him somewhere… and that could be very fucking accurate.

Where do you think they’d hide him?

BFB Da Packman: There’s so many places we hide in this world, man. I can hide in your house for a whole year, people will not know where I’m at.

That’s probably true.

BFB Da Packman: I could be in Flint, Michigan and hide for a whole year and people wouldn’t know.

The big thing would be money; if you have the money to disappear you can and Jeffrey Epstein definitely did.

BFB Da Packman: So yeah, I fuck with all that shit. I just don’t like the sick things people do with money. It seems like rich people are just into sick shit. I just want to make sure my family is rich and my friends are rich and then we’re just going to fuck women together. Not little girls. I’m talking some of the baddest women on every coast in the fucking world. And do you think when we’re… wait, how old was Jeffrey Epstein?

I think maybe in his 60s? I’m not sure.

BFB Da Packman: Do you think by the time we’re that old we can fuck every girl on every coast?

I’m not sure I understand the question.

BFB Da Packman: It’s just, why do they have to fuck kids, man? That’s different.

That’s a good question. One I’m not sure I know the answer to.

BFB Da Packman: You can fuck younger girls. Like 25, or 23. But you can’t be fucking no 16 year olds. That’s foul.

Anyways, I don’t hear a lot of rappers talking about conspiracies in their songs, so I had to ask.

BFB Da Packman: I just want to be an artist that everyone respects. Not love, but respect. That’s why I don’t come off as cocky. That’s why I fuck with my fans and will shake their hands when they see me. I won’t tell security to not let people touch me or anything.

Do you think you’re different from other rappers in that regard?

BFB Da Packman: No, not necessarily. Rappers are rappers, bro. Rappers are going to always do rapper shit.

It feels like so much of being a rapper these days involves being on social media and doing self promotion. Is that something you enjoy doing?

BFB Da Packman: I have to. I don’t have a major label. So I don’t have anybody running ads or doing shit for me every day. I don’t have 40 motherfucker’s thinking for me. All I have is me and my two managers and they have like 7 artists each, so a lot of it falls on me.

Do you hope to sign to a major label one day?

BFB Da Packman: Yeah, but it has to make sense. That’s one thing about these labels. They’ll say “we’re going to give it all we got. We’re going to blow you up,” and then if one release doesn’t go right they’ll abandon you.

They act like they’re the ones taking a big risk by investing in new artists but really it’s the other way around.

BFB Da Packman: Exactly, bro. BFB Da Packman is a billion dollar business. But right now, they’re the ones with the billion dollars in the bank and yet somehow the risk is on them? Come on, man.

Last I heard you hadn’t quit your day job at the postal service yet. Is that still true even after dropping the new album?

BFB Da Packman: Yeah, it’s beautiful. I get to go to work when I want to.

That’s a dope set up.

BFB Da Packman: People sleep on the postal service. You get really good benefits.

Are you involved in the union at all?

BFB Da Packman: That’s the reason I haven’t been fired!

So BFB Da Packman is pro-union? That’s on the record?

BFB Da Packman: Hell yeah, of course. Let’s get it out the mud baby.

How long have you been there and was it an easy job for you to get?

BFB Da Packman: I’ve been there since 2018. It was easy-hard. Bro, everything in life is easy-hard. If you want something bad enough, you’re going to get it. It’s just stubborn motherfuckers that go hard for the wrong shit and end up in jail or prison. But you can go hard for positive shit.

Where do you hope to be in a few years?

BFB Da Packman: I’m trying to make relationships and hopefully hit the right lottery ticket. Not the actual lottery, because I don’t believe in it like that, but I mean the right relationship, the right investment. So hopefully I run into the right information, put my money where my mouth is and I gamble and win.

If anybody’s reading this right now. If you know somebody in Hollywood. Please put me in a movie. Tell me where to go to acting classes. I want to be an actor. Hit Veli, my management or Solomon Sounds. I’m trying to be in a movie.

I think you could be a great actor. One of my favorite aspects of your music is your sense of humor, which could definitely translate to comedy movies pretty well. Do you have any comedians you look up to?

BFB Da Packman: No. I don’t really think I’m a comedian. I’m just humorous, bro. Everybody that grew up in the streets has a little humor in them.

Why do you think that is?

BFB Da Packman: We endured so much pain that we have to find some laughter somewhere. We gotta crack jokes, we gotta find something, somewhere, to laugh at.

Do you try to provide that with your music?

BFB Da Packman: Nah, I don’t think my music is funny. Name me a bar that you think is humorous?

One of my favorite BFB bars is “bitch, this a milkshake, not a smoothie.”

BFB Da Packman: That’s funny to you?

Yeah, my girlfriend is always drinking smoothies on a healthy tip and I constantly feel judged for getting milkshakes.

BFB Da Packman: The milkshake not a smoothie line is actually the truth. Because I ain’t drinking no motherfucking smoothie. I’m drinking a milkshake! Any other bars?

“They caught you with a brick and now you’re out, bitch I’m scared of you.”

BFB Da Packman: That’s the truth!

Can you see the humorous angle, though?

BFB Da Packman: Yeah, absolutely, but the shit that I’m saying is naturally true. It’s just that people haven’t heard it in rap form. Everybody is talking about “I got the bricks. I hit a lick. I robbed the plug,” and they’re not really doing that sht. I’m rapping about beating this bitch across the head with my dick.

Because that’s real for you?

BFB Da Packman: It’s real life for a lot of people. You got a girlfriend you live with. I bet you were probably beating her across the head with your dick, I don’t even know how many times this month. You can relate to that. You can’t relate to dude’s talking about shooting up an opp or putting money on somebody’s head. I’m rapping about real life shit. Just like this interview has been about real life shit. It’s like I’ve known you my whole life and that’s how it’s supposed to be! It’s not supposed to be awkward.

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